Arch is aimed at people who know their shit so they can build their own distro based on how they imagine their distro to be. It is not a good distro for beginners and non power users, no matter how often you try to make your own repository, and how many GUI installers you make for it. There’s a good reason why there is no GUI installer in arch (aside from being able to load it into ram). That being that to use Arch, you need to have a basic understanding of the terminal. It is in no way hard to boot arch and type in archinstall. However, if you don’t even know how to do that, your experience in whatever distro, no matter how arch based it is or not, will only last until you have a dependency error or some utter and total Arch bullshit® happens on your system and you have to run to the forums because you don’t understand how a wiki works.

You want a bleeding edge distro? Use goddamn Opensuse Tumbleweed for all I care, it is on par with arch, and it has none of the arch stuff.

You have this one package that is only available on arch repos? Use goddamn flatpak and stop crying about flatpak being bloated, you probably don’t even know what bloat means if you can’t set up arch. And no, it dosent run worse. Those 0,0001 seconds don’t matter.

You really want arch so you can be cool? Read the goddamn 50 page install guide and set it up, then we’ll talk about those arch forks.

(Also, most arch forks that don’t use arch repos break the aur, so you don’t even have the one thing you want from arch)

      • unique_hemp@discuss.tchncs.de
        4·
        4 days ago

        AFAIK no systemd -> no flatpak -> don’t recommend to newbs. Say what you will about flatpak, but it is the official distribution method for some popular pieces of software and large GUI software generally works better through it (in my experience) - think Blender, GIMP etc.

        • nullpotential@lemmy.dbzer0.com
          21·
          4 days ago

          No software worth its salt offers only flatpak installation. I don’t use flatpak at all and Blender works flawlessly. I’m not sure what a flatpak version could possibly do any better than the version I use.

          • unique_hemp@discuss.tchncs.de
            2·
            4 days ago

            I’m not sure what a flatpak version could possibly do any better than the version I use.

            The official OBS flatpak supports more codecs and integrations than some distro packages.

            Stability is also a factor, especially on rolling or cutting edge distros. Fedora RPM release of Blender did not work for me at all with an nvidia GPU, for example.

              • qpsLCV5@lemmy.ml
                2·
                3 days ago

                funnily enough, i see it as one of the advantages of arch, and a reason i’ll keep putting up with the constant updating for the forseeable future - nvidia support has gotten way better recently, and since arch has very recent packages i haven’t had nvidia issues in quite a while now.

                Once it all lands in debian i’ll consider giving debian another shot on desktop… but that’ll take a while.

            • nullpotential@lemmy.dbzer0.com
              1·
              4 days ago

              But we’re not talking about rolling or cutting edge distros. MX is based on Debian Stable. Also last time I checked (about a month ago) MX Linux does support Flatpak. Also also, you can enable systemd if you want, but seeing as we’re talking about a distro for complete beginners, I don’t think they’re going to notice, know, or care. Also also also, I really don’t care enough about this to drag it out into some protracted argument.

              Download ventoy, slap a few distros on a usb stick, try them, use what you like.

    • Petter1@lemm.ee
      57·
      4 days ago

      And then wonder why everybody having a good time with their nvidia on smooth wayland vs you on your ancient, ok now only old Kernel since the last ubuntu upgrade, and outdated nvidia drivers.

      Oh wait, with mint, you are forced to use clunky Xorg aren’t you

      I am sure that gives any noob the vibes of using a modern OS like windows/macOS /s

      • Bogasse@lemmy.ml
        7·
        4 days ago

        I’m not sure a newcomer will notice the difference between xorg and wayland?

        • Petter1@lemm.ee
          3·
          4 days ago

          I did, before I knew what wayland is, I did some distrohopping (see path below), and recognised that sometimes it feels more nice than other times. First I thought it was just GPU driver stuff, but later learned that it was something called wayland that does something underneath your desktop management (didn’t know that there is another layer below at that time)

          (mint->manjaro->manjaro(after it died once)->Opensuse TW(after manjaro died again)->Arch(because I liked installing from AUR more than from suse community hub)->EndeavourOS(because I don’t have time to do Arch manually and archinstall was to difficult/time consuming with dualbooting macOS)

      • lime!@feddit.nuEnglish
        4·
        4 days ago

        wayland is still too unstable for me to recommend. what is clunky about xorg?

        • Petter1@lemm.ee
          23·
          4 days ago

          Do you use a modern kernel? And, do you use a multi touch trackpad? That only works on wayland well.

          I personally see the difference in for example window movement Xorg VS wayland. And I have more artefacts from window manager if use Xorg BS when O use wayland.

          • lime!@feddit.nuEnglish
            1·
            4 days ago

            yes, yes, and it works without tearing in xorg no problem. multitouch is not xorgs nor wayland’s responsibility.

            • Petter1@lemm.ee
              1·
              4 days ago

              Umm no. Xorg only knows keyboard and pointer devices

              Everything must be put into one of those in hacky ways to work with Xorg, meaning you using a protocol for a device that can move itself, scroll and register clicks and keyboard to multitouch efects

              This, for example, results in swiping on Xorg is just clicking a keyboard shortcut, while in wayland you can smoothly scroll for and back between the virtual desktops mid animations

      • Endymion_Mallorn@kbin.melroy.org
        2·
        4 days ago

        Mint works like Windows and has a lot to offer any Windows 10 user who’s already using FOSS. And tbh Hypnotix alone justified the install of Mint for me. I got a great IPTV viewer, plus a PC that runs everything I want.

        Note: I only regularly want Discord, Firefox, Endless Sky, OpenTTD, RetroArch, and LibreOffice. I’m sure everyone else has different goals.

          • Endymion_Mallorn@kbin.melroy.org
            21·
            4 days ago

            Then whatever a modern OS is under your model is not an OS I’m willing to use. I’ve seen Win 11. I’m going to stick with 10, as I stuck with XP through Vista, had a second machine with 7 through 8(.x), and then surrendered and used Win10 when the 32-bit Win7 machine finally stopped working for love or money.

            • Petter1@lemm.ee
              2·
              4 days ago

              Well that is fair and I am very glad that Linux still offers you what you need and that you are fine with using X and have (still) more compatibility like this 😇