And that’s the story of why I switched to Arch <3
Obligatory Ubuntu sucks message
LIN 👏
NUX 👏
MINT 👏
I’ve seen plenty of Debian mentions, and no pushback there whatsoever from me.
But if you find yourself frustrated that you can’t just have Ubuntu without Canonical’s snaps and ads and other ickiness, Mint is exactly that. Or maybe better, I dunno. It’s super polished and full featured and stable.
And even better in this era of Windows 10 support ending, the main/default version (Linux Mint Cinnamon) looks like Windows out of the box but it installs, works, and updates at like 10x the speed. (The 10x is an exaggeration for moment to moment desktop work and latency, but for the install and especially for updates I think it’s accurate)
+1 for Mint. It’s what I give the elders when they need a computer.
Yeah, it is what I’m going to install on my parents’ Win10 machines, but it is also what I use myself at home and work. There are almost no new users I wouldn’t recommend it to.
No distro is going to work for everybody, of course, and having the choice is part of the beauty. The mint project is doing great stuff though.
I really enjoy Zorin. It’s based on Ubuntu from what I recall. Has great features too.
Yep, looks like it’s based on Ubuntu and specifically targets Windows converts with its out of box experience.
Their website is very commercial and “upgrade to pro now” though. If the distro isn’t pushy about it once installed, then maybe no big deal.
One nice thing with Mint is that it’s still funded by donations and sponsorships, and not any kind of commercial activity. It has that FOSSy aspect of being a good distro just for the sake of being good software for the world, not to be the entry point into somebody’s business plan.
It’s a distro that satisfies the side of me that’s the ADHD software engineer that wants access to the deepest most basic workings of my system, while also satisfying the side of me that’s an old man with a lot of non-computer hobbies outside work who just needs the shit to work unless I actively use my super user powers to break it.
the pro would be more ubuntu studio packages with curated and custom themes that make it look like windows/mac and other variants, which anyone can do themselves after like an hour or so googling gnome extensions and customizing them, they do look decent and ofc it goes towards continued support for both the free and pro version, if you like them its not a huge deal
Personally I think half the fun of linux is picking and customizing a de yourself to get a look only you have.
Themeing icons and other stuff does require external apps on gnome and can be more annoying than just using a preset theme thats nice too.
It hasn’t been pushy from my experience with it. The upsell is all on the site amd wasn’t too onerous imo.
I mostly just want shit to work too anymore. I don’t like spending my freetime fixing stuff that shouldn’t be broken. But I appreciate there being access to tinker when I need or want.
Agreed. I am currently struggling with loving an Arch/Hyprland build that does exactly what I want and nothing I don’t want, while simultaneously feeling like a loser for the amount of time I spend maintaining it or figuring out how to do some trivial tasks that take way too long because stuff doesn’t just work.
Man, this tiktokification just needs to die.
Linnux?
Saw it. Decided not to change it because that’s how somebody doing the “clapping on the syllable” thing would say it.
Check out Linux Mint Debian Edition (LMDE).
Yep that’s also an option if using an Ubuntu derivative at all is an issue for you.
I am literally running Ubuntu right now and I don’t get this comic. I have never been asked to subscribe to Ubuntu Pro, if I have it was noninvasive that I didn’t notice.
It’s only LTS. Desktop users rarely use LTS. Great to have live kernel updates on a developer workstation and servers though.
Thank you for educating me, but this makes less sense now. The only people who should/need to run LTS are people we a specific reason for staying on an older OS. And if that’s the case you should no what you are getting into.
Exactly, it’s just people finding an excuse to complain about. It’s more like an extension of the Unix wars or the editor wars or the browser wars. People have to find a reason to justify their choice.
That’s why I switched to Ubuntu. It gives me the safe corporate vibes while using Linux.
Why not RHEL then? It even has “enterprise” in the name!
Okay, sure, but how often does it spam ads?
Does it keep asking me to register for something that either shouldn’t need registering or exist at all? Does it tell me to subscribe for a service every time I open up the terminal?
We all need one or two ads, as a treat.
I like the animal wallpapers that come by default
I just dont feel safe without a random corporate office worker having full access to my device.
Did you know “Ubuntu” is Swaheli for “can’t get Debian installed”?
The language or the rotary flying machine
🤣🤣🤣🤣
Said the Swaheli in the Swaheli coast
I’m not afraid of Ubuntu, I’m afraid of the need to use the the Ubuntu forums when I have an issue.
I use arch wiki btw.
I recently switched to Eos and the arch wiki came in clutch many times (don’t try to an arch based system on a Mac without reading a ton of documentation, I learned that the hard way).
Only Ubuntu I’ve seen rtfm more than actually helpful commands
Really? All Linux installations worked just fine on my 2017 Air
Perhaps yours is an older model?It is indeed a bit older, 2015 pro. Most issues were with the WiFi (bcm46302 is a terrible chip omfg).
Besides that just some reverse engineered drivers for thermal management, but setting those up was more annoying on mint than on arch
Intolerable, scammy OS. Everything good in Ubuntu these days can be traced back to other projects, such as debian/Gnome/KDE. Whatever Canonical adds to that is just an attempt to lock you in their ecosystem or wring money out of you.
Just use debian instead.
Or mint, if you’re a newbie
Honestly, i don’t like debian and it’s derivatives because they focus on stability, and that means packages in the repos get outdated really quick. I’d love a distro that combines a debian base and the rolling release model of arch.
It’s called Debian Testing.
Debian testing is not rolling. Sid/unstable is.
What about debian SID?
That’s testing my patience.
I know it’s not exactly what you’re asking for but fedora is reaaaally nice. I don’t think I’ve had a single “unstable” package and it’s kept up to date really well. The only concern I have with it is red hat, I’m just hoping they don’t decide to enshittify
True, fedora is both up to date and stable. The main reason i came to arch anyways was the AUR, ArchWiki and the need to spice things up a bit. I also like how customizable the whole distro is. Because it’s basically a house’s materials and the blueprint, i can make whatever the hell i want to it :)
I’ve been using Fedora for 3 years now…loved the dnf way of dealing with packages and the upgrades were painless…the only thing that bothers me is my nvidia card…I have issues with games on steam and every update seems to mess with the nvidia kernel module somehow…so…
Im in the same boat and I regret buying NVIDIA.
I’m not a gamer but NVIDIA issues rear their head on Wayland mostly for things that need 3D rendering like Bambu Studio and even Electron apps like Slack, Spotify and VSCode.
Oh and also trying to get hardware video decoding working on Firefox is a pain. I’m now at the point where full screening a video just causes Firefox to immediately crash.
Definitely getting AMD next time but I’m a long ways off upgrading my NUC, it’s 8 core i7 with 64gb of ram so will serve my dev needs for a long time
Yeah, my next PC will definitely be AMD but I’m also not buying a new machine for a while…
What issue? I switched a friend to fedora KDE and installed the rpmfusion drivers and it’s been fine (40 series)
They’re mostly issues with steam and games… Steam app does not launch with the dedicated GPU…same with games…once I force it to use the nvidia card, games get worse and some of them don’t even launch… Same games I used to play when I had Ubuntu on my machine (my dell laptop came with Ubuntu 18.04 pre installed)
How did you install the drivers?
On Fedoraa, I followed this guide from fedora forum, installing them from rpmfusion…the akmod something…
If you’re using Linux for gaming, why not try Bazzite? It’s immutable, which is… Contentious. But it’s one of the best plug-and-play distros for gaming, with Nvidia support right out of the box.
I’m not just using it for gaming…I use it mostly for work … but I wanted to play a game or two eventually…that’s why I picked a general distro like fedora
You can always use sid. Or debian stable but you do everything that needs bleeding edge in a distrobox.
I’d love a distro that combines a debian base and the rolling release model of arch.
Debian Unstable.
LMDE
Not Debian, but closer if you haven’t seen it.
I have been loving Linux mint with KDE plasma! Best of both worlds
True, the apt packages can get outdated (or are already outdated at release time :) ). But tbh, for me that mainly affects the desktop environment these days and KDE is already pretty neat anyway. The CLI tools I use don’t change as much anymore, and the GUI tools are usually available as a flatpak so up-to-date.
That has ALWAYS been the case. I dont know why people are surprised now… ubuntu has alqays been backed by canonical. And it has always been based on the work of debian. What did people expect?
People have always been saying to just skip the corporate bullshit and go straight to the source… debian
Unfortunately there was a very loud group of people online shitting on debian, saying that it’s too difficult or user friendly or whatever… may have been true 10 years ago, but not anymore
I just set up a new home lab server and my first instinct was the latest Debian.
… Seemed fine to me.
I haven’t given them anything and have been using desktop for almost 3 years now. I run Ubuntu server at work without any issues either. I signed up for pro for free on my home desktop and didnt have to pay anything.
Where do they attempt to get money from me? Asking because I’m legitimately not sure.
Back when I used ubuntu on my server, it kept telling me there were additional security updates locked behind ubuntu pro.
Not sure why a message like that would even exist on a free system that’s supposed to be secure, so I switched to Debian just to avoid the abusive/corporate nonsense altogether.
Couldn’t be happier.
3 years, so I guess you have caught the Linux virus around that time as well?
They have a history of showing ads and sharing user data with amazon: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2012/10/privacy-ubuntu-1210-amazon-ads-and-data-leaks
Some of the other things they tried are a bit difficult to judge, but I lost my trust and count them as lock-in attempts. These include:
- snap packages (for real, just move over to flatpak already like everyone else!)
- mir: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mir_(software)
Notable good parts that I have not mentioned, but maybe should out of fairness:
- unity: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unity_(user_interface)
- I also think canonical was among the first to try and build some form of Linux mobile OS with some interesting ideas
Yeah, all the good parts of Ubuntu have been backported to Debian years ago.
What are they?
Better out-of-the-box hardware support, in my experience. We have a machine learning server at work, it didn’t see the GPUs on Debian Bullseye with the driver versions specified by the manufacturer, but worked perfectly with Ubuntu Server out of the box.
A distribution that is preconfigured by professionals has great value in a practical setting, even if that value has diminished in the eyes of the kind of person that Lemmy attracts. If I had tried to get Debian working by overruling the manufacturer’s instructions, I’d have to take responsibility for it, both its maintenance and the downtime and potential damage if I had fucked something up. With Ubuntu, I get to delegate at least part of the responsibility to Canonical (while covering my own ass), and that’s something you can’t backport.
This was five years ago, but yes, better out of the box hardware support. I tried installing Debian on my MacBook and Debian (or the Debian installer, don’t remember) booted to a black screen. Ubuntu worked out of the box for everything but the webcam and I still use it to this day.
In case you wanted your MacBook camera back, this worked like a charm for me on Ubuntu.
Mine was a Pro but I did follow similar if not the same steps. For whatever reason I couldn’t get it to persist over reboots but I did get it working for a while. Didn’t need it really on that laptop.
Thanks though!
I don’t know what Maestro is referring to, but Ubuntu has really good out of the box hardware support. Also it streamlined the installation process. Start it as a live CD, look around, if you like it, install it from the live environment. Generally they improved usability.
Live graphical installation and live environment has been a thing on fedora, suse, mandrake and a lot of distros since early 2000s. Ubuntu didn’t invent that.
I thought Ubuntu was one of the first. Something arround 2005. I am not sure though.
I think they are just saying they improved it but I don’t know.
The thing about Ubuntu that kills me (as a user of it) is the other users who comment on reddit/r/Ubuntu.
They are so confidentally incorrect about so much shit.
Talk about removing snaps?
“Core gnome functionality on Ubuntu requires snaps”
That’s not even remotely true. Snaps download Gnome* runtime libraries for it, just like Flatpaks do to run the snaps.
Just an example but still. I see so much crap like this.
Yeah, it’s the Cognitive Bias fallacy. Reminds me of all the anti Linux users who continue using the “Linux wont be ready for the average user, because no average user wants to write a compiler from scratch just so they can compile their programs”. If you don’t like something, you don’t like it. No problem, no reason to whine and cry about it. You like a different distro, great, go use it. That’s how distro’s work. Everything eventually helps everybody and you just pick a distro that gets you close to what you want. I started with Slackware 3.4, to me everything is great.
A friend of mine is a computer illiterate. His laptop doesn’t support Win11 because of the missing secure boot.
I installed Linux mint and showed him firefox, but he preferred chrome, so I got him Brave. Steam was downloaded, the update center was self explanatory.
He loves the speed.
Why would you install Brave when he liked chrome? You could have gone with any other non crypto bro non ad company chrome fork.
Basic Chromium would have been better.
That’s awesome. This is why Linux is king. The Linux inertia is building.
Wow, who would have thought the entry level linux distro might be full of inexperienced people who have no idea what they’re talking about.
I really hate all these snaps and flatpacks and docker and blah blah blah.
Its about impossible to find a simple series of commands to just install and run some program anymore.
I also keep running into issues, especially with Docker where it assumes its the only thing that exists and everything uses the same port.
Run a macvlan and give containers their own local IP. Or don’t expose the port on the host, and connect via reverse proxy.
Proxmox nagging subscription message on login be like
If you’re using proxmox in a production environment and making money it doesn’t cost much at all compared to VMware. I see it as helping fund production of software that right now still seems very solid
Proxmox devs are so close to making it a nice experience for homelabbers but they just leave a fresh install mangled so badly you need a helper script to give you sane settings. Not to mention if you make an Ubuntu vm with default settings it won’t boot. Plus the Linux user elitism on the forums. I want to like it more so much
Preach, in using proxmox myself but they still haven’t fixed bug when you install it from ventoy it tries to boot system from ventoy when system already installed on main drive, resulting in kernel panic, this bug still persists since 8.* Versions, and i have to fix it manually every time i install proxmox on another second hand pc/laptop for my homelab, for people who think it’s ventoy issue i write that i didn’t have this bug with any other distro, not even with god forsaken manjaro didn’t had this bug when i tried it three years ago
Apparently you can turn those off but I haven’t bothered.
This script does it as one of the steps https://pimox-scripts.com/scripts?id=post-pve-install
I think it’s like 2 lines in a config you gotta comment out
There are also very easy ways of making the nag screen go away.
https://community-scripts.github.io/ProxmoxVE/scripts?id=post-pve-install
But yes if you’re running this in prod, pay for it. It’s not expensive and way less then Broadcom VMWare…
This is why I switched back to Debian Stable on my servers, can’t deal with this shit.
Also the fact that if you’re not up to date on updates, you can go fuck yourself as far as Ubuntu is considered. Debian will let you upgrade from any version without complaints
Yep 100%. Ubuntu did this once, googled it, and said aloud “Ah hell no!! …” Between this and Snaps I was like ok I’m done. Started researching things like Mint and PopOs. Decided to just stick with Debian. Especially since ProxMox is basically just specialized Debian designed for KVM virtualization.
Yeah I also had a similar problem with updates. Had an old Ubuntu vm that I could not get to upgrade without lots of pain. It’s like they were trying to piss me off.
I don’t recall ever seeing such an ad in Ubuntu. Totally possible I wasn’t paying attention or I saw it and forgot.
It’s for LTS releases only. So you rarely see it on desktop, but for sure will see it on servers. My previous job, I ran LTS on my work laptop and would laugh at everyone always getting a forced update right before scrum. This new job, I have to use WSL on this Windows laptop and guess what, I’m in forced update hell. I can understand that for some(or most) the pro message would be annoying, but I’d rather see that pro message 100 times a day then get a forced update at random times. Especially right before meetings.
Hi. I’m a sysadmin as part of my day job.
I’m here to tell you that there’s a local group policy that will, with almost 100% certainty, override the policies set by active directory.
The issue is that you need to be a local admin to change those settings. If your IT department was smart enough (or dumb enough, depending on your perspective) to give you local admin, then it’s possible to go in and change settings that will give you control again.
There’s more settings than I can reasonably put into a Lemmy message, but I’m certain you can use your favorite search engine to find “local group policy settings for Windows update” and adjust them to your liking.
There’s a lot of nuance when it comes to this stuff, and I can’t guarantee the outcome. No matter what, good luck with it.
Thanks for the info. If I ever get upgraded security privileges, I’ll be sure to look for it.
It came up once at the initial install and once when I used the shell, then never bothered me ever again iirc.
Why won’t they leave me alone!
Is it really like that or is this a joke
Last I used Ubuntu you do indeed get an ad every time you apt upgrade You can still go into some config file and remove it though
When was the last time you used Ubuntu though?
Some people could say “last time I used Ubuntu it was full of Amazon ads!” But that would have been like 13 years ago
I’m an ubuntu user and it was like that for a brief period but then they removed it after an uproar. I think. I double check it once I’m at my laptop
I got a ThinkPad with Ubuntu 24.04 preinstalled and I haven’t seen a single Ubuntu Pro ad. But I saw them a lot on my old laptop with 22 installed. So either they’ve changed their ways or I suppose it’s possible Lenovo has preconfigured some settings.
Edit. 24.04 LTS
It’s LTS only. If you moved off of LTS, you wont’s see it again.
Pretty sure my work laptop tells me every time that I’m not getting some security upgrades, because I’m not using Ubuntu Pro.
I believe, there’s some semi-reasonable justification, that they’re only holding back upgrades for packages which they wouldn’t normally maintain anymore, but yeah, it still looks horrendous from an end-user perspective.
Just on LTS. Desktop users would only run LTS for 6 months or so. Right, and LTS only releases once every two years. I used LTS on my work laptop at my previous company. Great feature, but I can see it wouldn’t be as necessary for the end users. Hey, when everything is great, women have to find something to nit pick, am I right?!
just use Debian.
or even Linux Mint
Ubuntu Pro is free for up to 5 machines.
And if that’s not enough, you can just make a second account to get another 5.
And if the whole concept of getting extra security updates for packages that are out of support really bothers you, you can dummy out /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/20apt-esm-hook.conf
I’m not opposed to Canonical’s monetisation model. I think charging for extra updates and packages is fine as a way to make money. But I can understand why people don’t want advertising in their operating system, though I personally think that a simple line of text showing up on my terminal following a flood of package-fetching and script-running results is tolerable.
Canonical makes plenty of money through corporate partnerships without needing to muddy the basic user experience.
Ubuntu Pro is free for up to 5 machines.
Ubuntu pro Costs handing over your Data to a company.
And if the whole concept of getting extra security updates for unsupported packages really bothers you
And if it Bothers you that a company actually supports the packages it is making availible…
No, Ubuntu pro brings faster Security updates, even for still supported apps.
Ubuntu pro Costs handing over your Data to a company
An email address. That’s literally all they ask for. And they accept disposable emails. You don’t have to hand over anything.
Oh wow, I didn’t know that. Thank you for clarifying.
However I have to say I’m not necessarily against self promotion as companies and organisations have to sustain themselves but advertising your service every time the user updates or upgrades is way too much compared to KDE’s once-a-year donation request for example (that can be easily disabled).On another note I have experienced BTRFS and have seen the light, never returning to ext4 😭😭
I also was annoyed first like ew what the hell is going on here but then subscribed and it was absolutely free no ADs no sms. The style they choose to announce it is still weird tho
It’s just the LTS version, most desktop users don’t run that. Just 6 months out of two years probably.
… and live kernel security patches, removing the need to reboot out of schedule.
I’ve paid $$$ for that in commercial settings. Getting it for free is actually crazy.
…you can just make a second account…
I’m already gone if I have to make an account to run an OS on my hardware. Fuck everything about that.
I have to make an account to run an OS
You don’t.
We’re discussing Ubuntu Pro.
I can’t make an account, because I can’t complete a Recaptcha. Google Recaptcha is used on every ubuntu.com signin page. (This means I also can’t submit bug reports.)
Why can’t you complete a recaptcha? I totally understand not wanting to (I have Ublock Origin block them myself). But can’t?
Usually it’s this, but sometimes the Recaptcha doesn’t even load (looks like an IP ban). I just submit the form, and then get an error message saying I must complete a Recaptcha, but there’s no evidence in the page of any Recaptcha to fill out.
I’m on a residential ISP. I’ve checked every IP address reputation system I can find, and see no problems (except from “Clean Talk”, but they’re so small that I doubt Google uses them).
Also, I hate knowing that I’m doing unpaid labor to help train an AI that will make the world a worse place.
We got advtisment on lemmy before gta 6
Are you trying to be reasonable and pragmatic? Here? Good luck.
I love how in Garuda linux, the same command as
sudo apt update;sudo apt upgradeis justyay. Like “Yay, I’m upgrading my system!” Makes me happy when I run it even though it is a bit like pulling a slot machine lever for if it’s going to break something in my system. My plasmashell environment only recently got fixed. It was crashing like crazy for about 2 weeks.I currently try Bazzite, which is a gaming focused fedora-atomic spinoff. I think this is finally my distro to switch the desktop from windows.
